path: root/meeting-logs/20100714.txt

18:59 <@jmbsvicetto> ok, for reference here are 3 links about the issues to discuss:
18:59 <@jmbsvicetto> 1. - ferringb's proposal - http://dev.gentoo.org/~ferringb/required-use.html
19:00 <+tanderson> please make them (semi-)permament.
19:00 <@jmbsvicetto> 2. - ferrings's initial discussion about it - http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_b0e868626019f497eba47194c34e5421.xml
19:00 <@jmbsvicetto> 3. - last round of --as-needed discussion - http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_4d877108b67a4161eeaa5722aee7a297.xml
19:01 <@jmbsvicetto> tanderson: we'll add them to the agenda / summary / etc
19:01 <@jmbsvicetto> so, it's time
19:01 <+tanderson> okay.
19:01 <@jmbsvicetto> who are we missing?
19:01 <@jmbsvicetto> ferringb: ping
19:02 <@Chainsaw> Are phone numbers for ferringb available? If so, can they be used?
19:02 <+tanderson> Chainsaw: you need a warrant :p
19:02 <@jmbsvicetto> Gentoo warrant?
19:02 <@jmbsvicetto> ;)
19:02 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: I am here.
19:02 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: As am I.
19:03  * scarabeus smiles around
19:03 <@jmbsvicetto> Do we give 3 minutes for Brian to show up?
19:03 <@wired> yeah
19:03 < ssuominen> jmbsvicetto: since that last round of asneeded talking, we fixed last of the bugs with Xarthisius regarding having -Wl,--as-needed in LDFLAGS, 0 open bugs for that, and only 5-6 for forced asneeded
19:04 <@jmbsvicetto> ssuominen: ok
19:04 <@jmbsvicetto> thanks for the update
19:04 -!- jmbsvicetto changed the topic of #gentoo-council to: congrats to the new council. ferringb, halcy0n, jmbsvicetto, chainsaw, betelgeuse, scarabeus, wired || meeting: 14/7 19H00 UTC - now || next meeting 26/7 19H00 UTC
19:06 -!- jmbsvicetto changed the topic of #gentoo-council to: congrats to the new council. ferringb, halcy0n, jmbsvicetto, chainsaw, betelgeuse, scarabeus, wired || meeting: 14/7 19H00 UTC - now / agenda - http://dpaste.com/217481/ || next meeting 26/7 19H00 UTC
19:06 -!- wired changed the topic of #gentoo-council to: congrats to the new council. ferringb, halcy0n, jmbsvicetto, chainsaw, betelgeuse, scarabeus, wired || meeting: 14/7 19H00 UTC - now - http://bit.ly/bALQMi || next meeting 26/7 19H00 UTC
19:06 <@wired> lmao :D
19:06 <@wired> your's is better :)
19:06 <@jmbsvicetto> ok, we'll use yours ;)
19:06 <@jmbsvicetto> ok
19:06 -!- jmbsvicetto changed the topic of #gentoo-council to: congrats to the new council. ferringb, halcy0n, jmbsvicetto, chainsaw, betelgeuse, scarabeus, wired || meeting: 14/7 19H00 UTC - now / agenda - http://dpaste.com/217481/ || next meeting 26/7 19H00 UTC
19:07 <@jmbsvicetto> so, if someone can reach Brian, please recall him of the meeting
19:07 <@jmbsvicetto> shall we proceed?
19:07 <@Betelgeuse> yes
19:07 <@wired> yes
19:07 <@Chainsaw> Agreed.
19:07 <@scarabeus> yes
19:07 <@jmbsvicetto> probable date for council meetings?
19:08 <@jmbsvicetto> per our alias discussion, seems the best option are Mondays 19H00 UTC
19:08 <@Chainsaw> The time works well for me.
19:08 <@scarabeus> every 2nd monday 19H00 UTC?
19:08 <@Chainsaw> And indeed, any weekday except Tuesday is good.
19:08 <@jmbsvicetto> scarabeus: I like that
19:08 <@Halcy0n> scarabeus: works for me
19:09 <@wired> sounds good
19:09 <@jmbsvicetto> shall we vote for it?
19:09 <@scarabeus> jmbsvicetto: it looks like most people already said aye :]
19:09 < dleverton> Does that change to 20H00 when DST ends?
19:09 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: I would rather try to find a time that suits everyone.
19:10 <@Chainsaw> dleverton: UTC does not respect DST.
19:10 <@jmbsvicetto> Betelgeuse: sure
19:10 <@Chainsaw> dleverton: So yes, for most people the meeting time will shift by an hour.
19:10 < dleverton> Yeah, but I think there's been some confusion in the past about that
19:10 <@wired> Betelgeuse: i thought 1900 suits everyone?
19:10 <@Betelgeuse> wired: Voting implies going by a majority.
19:11 <@jmbsvicetto> Betelgeuse: I see there were no updates to the page :\
19:11 <@wired> Betelgeuse: ah, you're referring to the vote suggestion :)
19:11 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: which page?
19:11 <@scarabeus> the doodle page i guess
19:11 <@jmbsvicetto> The one with the time availability
19:11 <@jmbsvicetto> yes
19:11 <@Betelgeuse> missed that
19:12 <@scarabeus> i didnt update it because i can organise my time to fit anything you guys think up
19:12 <@Betelgeuse> Any way I prefer the meeting staying the same local time (- if we have a meeting where US And Europe are not in DST sync)
19:12 <@jmbsvicetto> so, does anyone have a problem with 2nd Monday of the month at 19H00 UTC ?
19:12 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: That works very well for me, thank you.
19:13 <@jmbsvicetto> Betelgeuse: so it would become 18H00 UTC when time changes?
19:13 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: 20UTC
19:13 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: UTC does not respect DST. So the time would stay the same.
19:13 <@scarabeus> yeah we can shift it to +1to fit even non sumer time
19:13 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: Did you mean CEST?
19:13 <@jmbsvicetto> Betelgeuse: thanks for correcting that
19:14 <@jmbsvicetto> Chainsaw: 19H00 UTC until DST kicks in and 20H00 UTC from then on
19:14 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: 19UTC/BST
19:14 <@jmbsvicetto> iirc, the problem is DST kicks in at different times in US and Europe
19:14 <@Betelgeuse> hmm no
19:14 <@wired> 1 week differene iirc
19:14 <@jmbsvicetto> right
19:14 <@Betelgeuse> 20BST 19UTC
19:14 <@Chainsaw> So what you meant was 19:00 GMT.
19:15 <@scarabeus> KILL MEEE
19:15 <@wired> lol
19:15 <@scarabeus> we will meet at this time
19:15 <@jmbsvicetto> iirc, it changes in the last Saturday of September in Europe
19:15 <@scarabeus> and when the summer time is over we add one hour
19:15 <@wired> lets just stick to 1900
19:15 <@wired> one meeting before dst change we can talk abou this
19:15 <@Halcy0n> WFM
19:15 <@Betelgeuse> Chainsaw: GMT == UTC for practical purposes
19:15 <@Chainsaw> Indeed, let's shelve this discussion.
19:15 <@jmbsvicetto> ok, let's defer that to the September meeting
19:16 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: Agreed. Next item?
19:16 <@Halcy0n> We've gone over our 5 minutes, so lets move on.
19:16 <@jmbsvicetto> sure
19:16 <@jmbsvicetto> So do we want to use bugs to track issues submitted to the council?
19:17 <@Chainsaw> It seems a good way, yes.
19:17 <@wired> i like the idea
19:17 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: the web app once GSoC is over
19:17 <@Chainsaw> As long as there is some control over who can submit bugs to that category.
19:17 <@Halcy0n> Betelgeuse: which web app is this?
19:17 <@scarabeus> council web app to manage our workflow
19:17 <@Betelgeuse> Halcy0n: We have a rails project to do anything that I can think of for the council.
19:18 <@jmbsvicetto> so bugs for now and the webapp later?
19:18 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: Okay. Can you make sure that the ability to file & comment bugs in the Council category is restricted?
19:18 <@Halcy0n> Bugs for now, and lets see how the webapp works out.
19:19 <@scarabeus> WFM
19:19 <@wired> +1
19:19 <@Chainsaw> Yes, agreed.
19:19 <@jmbsvicetto> Chainsaw: I don't think infra cand do that now, but we can apply the same rules for abuse in bugzilla
19:19 <@jmbsvicetto> s/cand/can/
19:19 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: Restricting the filing might be difficult, but restricting the ability to comment sounds realistic.
19:19 <@Halcy0n> We can restrict commenting, like devrel, but do we really want to do that?
19:19 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: And should probably be done. My mailbox will thank you if we ever vote on a contentious issue.
19:20 <@jmbsvicetto> Chainsaw: let's ask infra and wait for their reply, ok?
19:20 <@Halcy0n> I'm not certain why we are restricting the bugs...nor do I agree with that.
19:20 <@jmbsvicetto> idl0r: if you can comment, please do
19:20 < a3li> if I may, there is no option to make a bug 'read-only' only for certain people by default
19:20 <@Halcy0n> If people abuse bugzilla, we can deal with that, but we shouldn't be making the bugs hidden.
19:21 <@Chainsaw> Halcy0n: Because seas of "No, this is a stupid idea" "I disagree it is great, please vote yes" are tiresome.
19:21 <@Chainsaw> Halcy0n: I don't mean to restrict viewing.
19:21 <@Chainsaw> Halcy0n: Just commenting.
19:21 <@jmbsvicetto> Halcy0n: I assume the goal is to restrict access to people in the reporter, assigned and cc fields
19:21 <@Betelgeuse> No discussion should happen in bugzilla.
19:21 <@Betelgeuse> Even by us.
19:21 <@Halcy0n> Bugzilla shouldn't be used as a discussion medium anyway.
19:21 <@Chainsaw> Indeed. But people will if you give them the chance. So restrict comments please, nip it in the bud.
19:21 <@jmbsvicetto> I agree in principle with Halcy0n and Betelgeuse 
19:21 <@Halcy0n> Keep them open, if people don't use the tools correctly, we deal with it.  I don't want to deal with a possible non-issue before we even encounter it.
19:22 <@jmbsvicetto> there are already tools to deal with people that abuse bugzilla
19:22 <@Chainsaw> As you wish.
19:22 <@wired> I think we should leave them open as well. if people misbehave continously we can revisit restricting them
19:22 <@Chainsaw> Move on, next item?
19:22 <@Halcy0n> Well, did we reach consensus before moving on?
19:22 < idl0r> jmbsvicetto: what's up?
19:23 <@Chainsaw> Halcy0n: Yes, the majority was against my idea of restricting bugs in any way.
19:23 <@jmbsvicetto> So, the idea is to use bugs and check the webapp when it's ready
19:23 <@Halcy0n> We will use bugzilla for tracking council issues (no restrictions), and will look at the webapp when it is declared complete?
19:23 <@Betelgeuse> idl0r: Can we hide products?
19:23 <@Betelgeuse> I wouldn't open a new product for Council and use it for a month if it would stay there indefinetely.
19:24 <@jmbsvicetto> can we move forward?
19:24 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: I would like that.
19:25 <@jmbsvicetto> so should we have a section on all meetings to check the status of open bugs?
19:25 <@jmbsvicetto> So that we can keep track of issues assigned to council and what is happening on them?
19:25 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: Yes.
19:25 <@scarabeus> of course we should check our work
19:25 < idl0r> Betelgeuse: no, at least not in bugzilla-2. in bugzilla-3 dunno
19:25 <@scarabeus> we could also use voting there
19:25 < idl0r> Betelgeuse: but restricting bugs is possible
19:25 <@jmbsvicetto> this would obviously be done in the future for the webapp (if / when we get it)
19:26 <@Halcy0n> I don't know if we would want to check them every time, perhaps setting deadlines and revisiting those issues when the deadline has been reached?
19:26 <@jmbsvicetto> Halcy0n: if something is still inside a deadline, we can lose 30 seconds just stating that ;)
19:26 <@Chainsaw> It's good to have the reminder.
19:27 <@jmbsvicetto> Should we try to have one council member directly responsible for each bug? So there's an individual responsibility beyond the team collective responsibility?
19:27 <@wired> sounds good
19:27 <@Chainsaw> Yes, that makes sense.
19:28 <@scarabeus> but we should not force it, maybe voting in bugzilla, people can use popular bugs that we could take
19:28 <@ferringb> holy backlog ;)
19:28 <@scarabeus> people might open bugs but there might be even more important ones (by the voting it can be determined)
19:28 <@jmbsvicetto> Hi Brian
19:28 <@wired> ferringb! :)
19:29 <@ferringb> sorry, in the midst of a release
19:29  * ferringb goes back to catching up
19:30  * wired fetches some water
19:31 <@scarabeus> ok i think both are good ideas
19:31 <@scarabeus> anyone against
19:31 <@scarabeus> discussion about bug progress should happen on each meeting.
19:31 <@scarabeus> each bug will have assigned named council member that should be responsible for its implementation.
19:31 <@scarabeus> this can also utilize bugzilla voting metod, if used by developers.
19:31 <@scarabeus> from summary
19:31 <@Halcy0n> sounds good to me
19:31 <@wired> +1
19:31 <@jmbsvicetto> +1
19:32 <@Chainsaw> Summary agreed, next item?
19:32 <@wired> > ability to have 2nd monthly / impromptu meetings when required
19:32 <@jmbsvicetto> are we willing to have a 2nd meeting per month or an improptu meeting when required?
19:32 <@jmbsvicetto> Do we need to state that or is that a given?
19:32 <@Betelgeuse> Ddin't we agree to meet every second week already?
19:33 <@jmbsvicetto> We said we would meet at the 2nd Monday of the onth
19:33 <@jmbsvicetto> month*
19:33 <@scarabeus> we can have any  meeting during the month
19:33 <@Chainsaw> And anything extra can be agreed at one of those meetings.
19:33 <@scarabeus> but i would like at least week headsup
19:33 <@Chainsaw> Yes, a week notice is the minimum I would need.
19:33 <@scarabeus> like 8.8. -> announce meeting for 15.8. due to nuclear holocaust
19:34 <@ferringb> week headup is a requirement for me
19:34 <@Halcy0n> Same
19:34  * ferringb notes he can swing impromptu's, but that's an exception, not a rule
19:34 <@jmbsvicetto> Do we want to make any statement about this or just discuss it if / when it becomes needed?
19:34 <@Chainsaw> Okay, we meet every second Monday at 19:00 UTC until further notice. 1 week notice required for any changes.
19:34 <@Betelgeuse> I don't have other duties at these hours.
19:35 <@ferringb> if/when works for me personally
19:35 <@Chainsaw> All in favour?
19:35 <@Halcy0n> fine by me
19:35 <@Betelgeuse> sure
19:35 <@scarabeus> aye
19:35 <@jmbsvicetto> ok
19:35 <@wired> 1 week notice is fine by me
19:35 <@jmbsvicetto> next?
19:36 <@scarabeus> secretary/chair
19:36 <@jmbsvicetto> Do we want a secretary?
19:36  * jmbsvicetto looks at tanderson 
19:36 <@scarabeus> we need chair, i am willing to do it, but we might want to rotate so all of us will have the fun?
19:36 -!- rokybid [~foolio@67.220.166.250] has joined #gentoo-council
19:36  * tanderson is expected to give some form of answer
19:36 <@wired> i think the wave thing is working for summaries
19:36 <@scarabeus> quite well isn't it?
19:37 <+tanderson> whatever you decide, don't make a non-council member the chair
19:37 <@wired> i think chairing can be decided per-meeting
19:37 <+tanderson> what wave thing?
19:37 <@Halcy0n> Rotating amongst ourselves (those that want to), should work fine.  Using wave for the summaries is working nicely.
19:37 <@Chainsaw> tanderson: That overhyped google wiki.
19:37 <@Halcy0n> tanderson: Google Wave
19:37 <+tanderson> yeah, how are you using it?
19:37 <@wired> tanderson: we are using google wave to interactively create the summary
19:37 <@scarabeus> right now we are writting summary
19:37 <@jmbsvicetto> The wave thing is working, but if we want to use it to all meetings, we should assure all council members are either willing to use it or to have it used
19:38 <@wired> during this meeting
19:38 <+tanderson> ooh, but with that, you don't need a secretary doing stuff, correct?
19:38 <@wired> jmbsvicetto: wave does *not* require a google account now, that should make things easier
19:38 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: We don't need all council members there.
19:39 <@Halcy0n> Really we only need a few of us to ensure it gets done.
19:39 <@jmbsvicetto> Betelgeuse: sure, but we must check if someone objects to its use, no?
19:39 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: Whatever gets the job done.
19:39 <@ferringb> same from my stance.
19:39 <@Betelgeuse> jmbsvicetto: It's better to not have everyone there so discussion doesn't spill there.
19:39 <@jmbsvicetto> I'm fine with using wave
19:39 <@Halcy0n> same
19:40 -!- rokybid [~foolio@67.220.166.250] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:40 <@wired> great
19:40 <@jmbsvicetto> If we're ok with wave, that takes care of summaries. What about agendas and initial email warning about a meeting?
19:40 <@Chainsaw> I'm not opposed to wave, but I'm unlikely to participate.
19:40 <@wired> we just need to make sure that someone will commit the summaries each time :P
19:41 <@scarabeus> that should be done by last months chair
19:41 <@scarabeus> jmbsvicetto: ^
19:41 <@Betelgeuse> wired: we could end the meeting officially with that
19:41 <@jmbsvicetto> I think the person being chair for a meeting should take care of the agenda and initial email - which means the chair should be chosen before a meeting
19:41 <@scarabeus> the agenda for next meeting + commiting current stuff we have
19:42 <@wired> i like scarabeus' recommendation. he who chairs is responsible for next time
19:42 <@jmbsvicetto> I'm willing to be chair on a rotating basis
19:42  * wired too
19:42 < NeddySeagoon> choose the chair for the next meeting at the end of the current one or on the ml
19:42 <@Halcy0n> Same, to both
19:42 <@ferringb> duck duck goose?
19:43 <@Chainsaw> Selecting at the end of the meeting makes a lot of sense.
19:43 <@scarabeus> but end meeting selection makes really lots of sense
19:43 <@Chainsaw> And yes, I too share an ambition to one day be a rotating chair.
19:43 <@jmbsvicetto> so the chair for a meeting will be chosen at the end of the previous meeting. Does everyone accept?
19:43 <@Betelgeuse> yes
19:43 <@wired> yeah
19:43 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: Agreed.
19:43 <@Halcy0n> +1
19:44 <@jmbsvicetto> and the chair will be responsible for sending the initial email and setting up the agenda
19:44 <@jmbsvicetto> can we move to the next point: allowing council members to present issues they'd like to see addressed this term?
19:44 <@wired> great
19:45 <@jmbsvicetto> anyone wants to start?
19:45 <@Chainsaw> Yes. Death to (the official status of) overlays.
19:45 <@Chainsaw> Development happens in the tree where everyone can QA it.
19:46 <@Chainsaw> If it is "not done yet", you mask it.
19:46 <@scarabeus> Chainsaw: it cant happen, imagine kde-base +600 weirdly broken ebuilds...
19:46 <@scarabeus> but we can move to unofficial
19:46 <@jmbsvicetto> Chainsaw: you're going to face some opposition about that
19:46 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: I know.
19:47 <@wired> it could happen
19:47 <@wired> but not with cvs :p
19:47 <@Chainsaw> scarabeus: I'm not saying don't use overlays. I'm saying don't have official overlays. Only take bugs about what is in the tree.
19:47 <@Chainsaw> scarabeus: Using them for staging and then moving your ebuilds to the tree in good time makes sense.
19:47 <@scarabeus> Chainsaw: so you probably dont like gnome approach
19:47 <@scarabeus> we do mostly 0days
19:47 <@Chainsaw> scarabeus: Having official overlays with bugs in the tracker and ebuilds that never make it to the tree are not.
19:48 <@jmbsvicetto> Chainsaw: I suggest we leave discussions for future meetings ;)
19:48 <@scarabeus> yeah lets not argue now, just show our visions :]
19:48 <@jmbsvicetto> Chainsaw: Any other issue you'd like us to address in this term?
19:48 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: Unmaintained packages.
19:48 <@jmbsvicetto> what about them?
19:48 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: I'd like a documented procedure to take an unloved package over with a set limit.
19:49 <@jmbsvicetto> So discuss rules (policy) about unmaintained packages?
19:49 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: If the maintainer fails to respond in say... 1 week, you take it over and there is no song & dance about it later. </example>
19:49 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: And you use a bug for this, so there is an official record.
19:50 <@scarabeus> oh not taking mn packages
19:50 <@scarabeus> but overtaking from someone else
19:50 <@Chainsaw> From a maintainer that has apparently lost interest, should be retired but isn't yet, etc.
19:50 <@scarabeus> oka
19:50 <@scarabeus> anything else?
19:50 <@Chainsaw> Packages in limbo that under the current rules, you can't really touch. But that you rely on for business. Asterisk comes to mind.
19:50 <@jmbsvicetto> in that case you want to review the current policy about package maintainance
19:50 <@Chainsaw> No, that's my two super-controversial proposals out.
19:51 <@Chainsaw> Someone else can have a go now.
19:51 <@scarabeus> jmbsvicetto: how about you
19:51 <@jmbsvicetto> ok, I want to continue the work to review GLEP39 and Gentoo's metastructure
19:52 <@scarabeus> ok everyone knows whats that :]
19:52 <@scarabeus> anything else?
19:52 <@jmbsvicetto> and to study and promote ways to allow more involvement from community
19:52 <@jmbsvicetto> I don't have any particular issues for now
19:53 <@jmbsvicetto> scarabeus: you?
19:53 <@scarabeus> ok so lets talk about my shiny hat:
19:53 <@scarabeus> 1) qa and its involvement (that is probably on marks hat too, i want to bash people more for commiting crap simply put)
19:53 <@scarabeus> 2) PR reviwe GWN
19:54 <@scarabeus> with the hard push on the W, because it is manageable in few people
19:54 <@scarabeus> We desperately need PR and global knowledge
19:54 <@scarabeus> people really think we are dead if i go on few confs and stuff :]
19:54 <@Chainsaw> I'm on-board with the QA proposal.
19:54 <@Chainsaw> PR is not my thing, but I won't be in your way.
19:54 <@Chainsaw> (Although I can probably help if you want to publish an article in our HotLINX newsletter)
19:55 <@scarabeus> i actualy already have people that will translate it to cze and probably publish it on largest linux emagazine in cze, so at least in cze we are covered :P
19:55 <@scarabeus> i just need to really organise what will be on it
19:56 <@Chainsaw> The magazine we publish goes to people in the ISP industry.
19:56 <@scarabeus> Chainsaw: sweet
19:56 <@Chainsaw> It's a completely different audience that you might want to touch on.
19:56 <@scarabeus> well isp is one of those guys who have large pc infrastructures so they are target :]
19:56 <@scarabeus> but anyway that is not for this summary show, so who is next
19:56 <@ferringb> re: pkg takeover, it should be more ability to do work on it... takeover being a bit longer imo
19:57 <@scarabeus> ferringb: so what are your plans, since you talks
19:57 <@scarabeus> s//
19:57 <@Halcy0n> I just want to point out that we are about to run out of time. :)
19:58 <@scarabeus> yeah
19:58 <@Chainsaw> So, next item please?
19:59 <@Halcy0n> I don't think we are finishing anything in 2 minutes. :)  I have my boss waiting to talk to me :)
19:59 <@ferringb> scarabeus: plans re: takeover... basically I'd leave that to tree policy, aka QA to some degree.  let the community sort it out ;)
19:59 <@ferringb> Halcy0n: same
19:59 <@scarabeus> ferringb: not thoughts about those plans :P your plans :P
19:59 <@scarabeus> i guess jorge want us to say : i want to do a and hopefully b
19:59 <@scarabeus> thats it
19:59 <@scarabeus> one sentence to put to summary
20:00 <@ferringb> scarabeus: long term plans council wise, I'd like to have the council slightly less involved day/day community wise- light touch approach basically.  cardoe does have a point in my opinion- we don't need to be involved in every little thing
20:01 <@scarabeus> Halcy0n: you?
20:01 <@ferringb> scarabeus: technical side of it, PMS will be a bit of a focus obviously for me ;)
20:01 <@jmbsvicetto> sorry, I lost my internet connection for the past 5 minutes
20:01 <@wired> I want to make sure we as a council are decisive and effective throughout our term, making good decisions :)
20:01 <@Chainsaw> Halcy0n: A bigger QA banhammer, yes?
20:02 <@Halcy0n> Yes, and work on making it easier for people to know how to join/help out.  Basically involving the community more.
20:02 <@Betelgeuse> Halcy0n: What would be needed beyond current powers?
20:03 <@Halcy0n> I don't really have time right now to discuss it, but I have some ideas that would drastically change recruitment that I would like to propose to the dev community as a whole.
20:03 <@Betelgeuse> Halcy0n: There's a GSoC project for that too.
20:03 <@jmbsvicetto> Do we want to continue the meeting or do we need to finish it in a few minutes?
20:04 <@Chainsaw> I have a need to vacate this building in roughly 15 minutes.
20:04 <@Chainsaw> So if we could not start anything that will take a long time to complete, I'd appreciate it.
20:04 <@scarabeus> Betelgeuse: and your plans? if not secrit?
20:04 <@jmbsvicetto> I would like to give a chance for the community to present any ideas it has - next point
20:05 <@jmbsvicetto> I can leave the discussion about --as-needed and required-use for the next meeting
20:05 <@scarabeus> jmbsvicetto: no discussion, i want vote
20:05 <@Betelgeuse> scarabeus: I'll probably be busy with putting the GSoC results to use for most part of the year.
20:05 <@scarabeus> there is nothingreally to discuss about as needed
20:05 <@Betelgeuse> scarabeus: Then mostly PM stuff.
20:05 <@jmbsvicetto> I don't need to leave for anything, so I can be around for a long while if someone wants to continue the meeting
20:05 <@scarabeus> Betelgeuse: oky
20:06 <@Chainsaw> scarabeus: I am fully in favour of as-needed being introduced into profiles. As a demonstration of my commitment to your cause: https://issues.asterisk.org/view.php?id=14671
20:06  * ferringb really needs to get back to work
20:06 <@ferringb> jmbsvicetto: leaving them to the next meeting makes the most sense imo anyways
20:07 <@jmbsvicetto> ok. Anyone else wants to present his ideas for this term?
20:07 <@jmbsvicetto> are we missing anyone?
20:07 <@scarabeus> jmbsvicetto: we have everyone
20:07 <@jmbsvicetto> ok
20:07 <@Betelgeuse> I want to stop global warming.
20:07 <@scarabeus> so community what do you want? :]
20:07 <@jmbsvicetto> If someone is willing to stay a few more minutes, I'd like to give a chance for the community to present their requests (next agenda itme)
20:08 <@jmbsvicetto> item*
20:08 <@Chainsaw> I can stay a few more minutes.
20:08 <@wired> lets decide who's chairing the next one first
20:08 <@Chainsaw> But not very long. So please proceed.
20:08 <@Chainsaw> wired: You are.
20:08  * scarabeus rises hand
20:08 <@scarabeus> if nobody else wants
20:08 <@wired> Chainsaw: really? I thought it was you! heheh :p
20:09 <+tanderson> I'd like to get a guarantee from the council that decisions will be made based solely on the merit of proposals, not based in any way on anything to do with the person making the proposal.
20:09 <@jmbsvicetto> as this was a special meeting and I did send the original email, I'll commit the summary for the meeting
20:09 <@scarabeus> tanderson: i listen even to ciaran, if it makes sense
20:10 <@scarabeus> jmbsvicetto: for NEXT meeting ;]
20:10 <@Chainsaw> Yes, wired chairs the next meeting.
20:10 <@Chainsaw> So, was there anything else?
20:10 <+tanderson> my question.
20:10 <@ferringb> open it up to the community imo
20:10 <@scarabeus> nope most of you can disappear if needed, we will sit around and wait for the comunity to talk with us :]
20:11 <@wired> lmao :) alright
20:11 <@Chainsaw> tanderson: All I care about is the proposal itself. Even if you submitted it, I'd still look at seriously. Okay?
20:11 <+tanderson> I'm not talking about me, but point taken.
20:12 <@jmbsvicetto> scarabeus: I'll submit the summary for this meeting.
20:12 <@scarabeus> okay
20:12 <@jmbsvicetto> So who's going to be next meeting's chair? wired or scarabeus ?
20:12 <@Chainsaw> jmbsvicetto: wired.
20:12 <@wired> i'll do it
20:12 <@scarabeus> ok
20:12 <@Chainsaw> tanderson: I know you aren't. But I'm glad you understand :)
20:14 <@jmbsvicetto> So if someone else has anything to suggest to the council, feel free to do so
20:14 <@Chainsaw> We will listen!
20:14 <@scarabeus> isn't mute on?
20:14 <@Chainsaw> Please speak...
20:14 <@Chainsaw> scarabeus: I don't see a +m, no. They've just been very well behaved.
20:14 <@scarabeus> we feel lonely
20:14 <+tanderson> scarabeus: no.
20:14 <@jmbsvicetto> I suggest we give 30 minutes before closing the summary
20:14 <@scarabeus> tell us something
20:14 < dleverton> "wired chairs the next meeting" sounds like you're going to bring in electric chairs for all the council members
20:14 <@scarabeus> i will show you my friendly face if you will talk :]
20:14 < dleverton> Does that count?
20:15 <@jmbsvicetto> In the meanwhile, is there any other business?
20:15 <@Chainsaw> scarabeus: Or they have all been watching amusing pictures of cats on the internet. Who knows.
20:15 <@scarabeus> dleverton: ok, my friendly look http://hlukotvor.blesmrt.net/~scarab/fotky/IMAG0017.jpg :D
20:16 <@jmbsvicetto> If not, let's consider the meeting over, but consider any suggestions in the next 30 minutes in the summary
20:16 -!- thrice` [thrice@unaffiliated/thrice/x-000000001] has left #gentoo-council []
20:16 <@Chainsaw> I have to alarm this building in 4 minutes.
20:16 <@Chainsaw> So I shall leave now.
20:17 <@scarabeus> Chainsaw: cya
20:17 <@Chainsaw> Thank you all for a productive meeting, and I look forward to seeing you again next week.
20:17 <@wired> cya Chainsaw
20:17 -!- Chainsaw [~chainsaw@gentoo/developer/atheme.member.chainsaw] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:20 <@scarabeus> so guys, is it so hot at your places too?
20:20 <@scarabeus> 37 degrees in shade today
20:20 <@scarabeus> :]
20:20 <@scarabeus> (maybe someone will start talking)
20:22 < dleverton> Was pretty dreary here
20:22 <@ferringb> heat finally broke for us on the weekend... 70F, down from near 100F last week
20:22 < dleverton> Didn't go out today though
20:22 < dleverton> Actually a nice change from the heat
20:22 < dleverton> O
20:23 < dleverton> *(Probably never counted as "heat" by your standards in the first place)
20:23 -!- Halcy0n [~halcy0n@gentoo/developer/halcyon] has quit [Quit: leaving]
20:23 <@scarabeus> that is quite nice :]
20:23 <@scarabeus> also note i speak in Celsius of course :P
20:23 <+tanderson> thunderstorms here, 29 :)
20:24 <@scarabeus> dleverton: apropos, i look friendly dont i? :]
20:24 < dleverton> Hard to tell behind the face-paint :-P
20:24 <@wired> the new council meeting time is now reflected on google gentoo calendar :)
20:25 <@scarabeus> sweet i should start using google calendar :D
20:25 <@wired> scarabeus: you have android, you should be using it already :p
20:25 <@scarabeus> wired: stop doing that for me
20:25 <@scarabeus> i disabled it
20:25 <@scarabeus> :D
20:25 <@wired> scarabeus: re-enable it :P
20:26 <@scarabeus> jmbsvicetto: btw i think that open  30 minutes are useless, it is 20 now and nobody spoke up, it wont change...
20:26 <@wired> scarabeus: also install the "Android Agenda Widget", it rocks :)
20:26 <@wired> indeed, lets end this here
20:26 <@jmbsvicetto> ok
20:26 <@jmbsvicetto> http://dpaste.com/218207/ <- proposed summary
20:27 <@jmbsvicetto> we had another clear day here
20:27 <@scarabeus> aye aye sir
20:28 <@wired> looks good
20:28 <@jmbsvicetto> ok, I'm going to commit that, right after I have my dinner
20:28 <@jmbsvicetto> So let's call the meeting closed